I've heard lot's of conservative talking heads and libertarians call Obama a Marxist. Is that a fair claim?
Let's look at the Communist Manifesto (by Marx) which should be a pretty good stick to measure him by. If you've never read it, you probably should (at least once) if for no other reason than to know what to look for.
http://www.anu.edu.au/polsci/marx/classics/manifesto.html
The 10 "planks" of the communist platform (this is from near the end of section two) are (and I've put my comments in parentheses):
1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.
(I don't know on this one.)
2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
(Yeah, Obama's tax plan includes such a beast, and he's not bashful about it. for an interesting aside, check out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTwxqgVvEyU)
3. Abolition of all rights of inheritance.
(Obama has stated that he supports a heavy estate {death} tax. That is definitely a step in the "all rights" direction.)
4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
(Nothing I can think of.)
5. Centralization of credit in the banks of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.
(Has voted for the bailout, which is definitely a step in that direction.)
6. Centralization of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the state.
(I think control over communication meets the same purpose. The "fairness" doctrine would definitely meet that goal.)
7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the state; the bringing into cultivation of waste lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
(Sounds a lot like government enforced environmentalism to me. I could be wrong, though.)
8. Equal obligation of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
(I don't know on this one, either.)
9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.
(I don't know the purpose of this one, so I don't know if it fits Obama or not.)
10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labor in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, etc.
(This juicy nugget is already the status quo in the U.S... Obama has stated that he would support a national school accreditation program, which of course would give the government more control over schooling.)
So of the ten, it appears to me that Obama at least subscribes to six. That sounds like a pretty good start toward Marxism to me, but does that make him a Marxist?
Help me out here, what are the things I'm missing/incorrect about?
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Re-educating Camp...?
I'm not sure if he's really Marxist, but I know he's really black. Let's look at the bright side of things :)
"The government should be afraid of its people, not the other way around".
On July 2 in Colorado Springs, he said,
"We can no longer rely only on our military for our security. We need a civilian security force that is just as powerful, just as strong, and just as well funded."
Pretty scary. Transcripts of this speech put out by the Obama campaign mysteriously omitted this statement, but you tube videos are there to verify it. I can only think of a few leaders in history that have done anything like this: STalin, HItler, Mussonlini. Pretty scary.
Tom Mullen
www.tommullen.net
www.myspace.com/skepticsongs
"Question with boldness even the existence of a God" - Thomas Jefferson
what our career military thinks about a civilian security force. Are they going to just roll over and take this lying down because some freshman President says so? "Oh sure, I'll be happy to toss my 25 years into the NWO sewer..." ???
I don't think so.
_________________
Freedom is an inside job
they should give those forces a catchy acronym like for example, SS for Security Services. while the quote you posted is pretty scary, the scarier thing is that nobody cares. i will once again reitirate my position on the situation: things are too far gone to flip them back around, people have been bamboozled and confused, the main focus of the freedom movement should be education mostly of young people so that blame will be correctly applied when shit hits the fan. furthermore, i can only hope for a swift and immediate decline as only a slap in the face will make people snap out of it. if we continue on this gradual roller coaster then people will keep taking the abuses one at a time.
Marxism is a movement towards communities of equal sharing of property and socialist programs(a false utopia). Obama is a marxist right now in what he practices...but once he achieves the thrown in the white house he will turn into what he really is...a dictator. That is when his marxist followers will turn in disarray and try to reject him,but it will be too late.
Utopia can not exist without sytematically taken out any questioners-murder.
Laurie
Bryce,
The Communist Manifesto was a work designed to inspire the masses. I was not where Marx laid out his philosophy of dialectical materialism or his ideas on economics.. We could find all sorts of people from all ends of the political spectrum who could score a few points on the type of test you are giving here.
The most important thing to remember is that most people nowadays who profess to be Marxists are not classical Marxists. They know or care little or nothing about economics or Marx's philosophy. Instead, they have turned to cultural Marxism, which in my opinion is much deadlier. Marxists are no longer economists, but sociologists trying to crush traditional culture and replace it with an artificial one.
The term "marxist" has been banalized beyond recognition. Originally Karl Marx had hoped his economic philosophy would take root in the then United States of America. He was tormented that it had been co-opted by the Boshleviks. (I can site the source of this statement if anyone needs it... just don't feel like digging through my books right now.)
__________________
Freedom is an inside job
Truthserum,
This confusion about the term Marxism is one reason we often have trouble nailing down who our enemies are. We point out that a candidate is a Marxist, meaning the cultural variety, and then someone points out the candidates connection to big business capitalists to refute the charge on economic grounds.
We need to change our terms for the sake of precision. Cultural Marxism needs a new name.
The terms are sufficiently numerous and precise -- as is most generally the case -- however the argument is generally malformed and emotionally based. Try to build tighter arguments using the accepted terms (clarifying, if necessary) and see where that takes us. Changing the "terms" in the course of an ongoing debate is at best unproductive and at worst, intellectually dishonest.
When calling Obama a marxist, he is a marxist for the people,and then he behind the scenes will become the dictator. Marxists dont even know what they are many times, but they are marxists, who support what they think is a fellow marxist(a person like them leading them to victory)......they seeek equality,and social programs, and a "utopian" wet dream. OF COURSE we know Obama is going to turn into a dictator,and it wont be what the marxist followers asked for. History proves this.
We don't "know" that O'bama is going to turn into a dictator. And Marxism, which has now become a buzzword tossed around by the uneducated, is only a factor in a multi-directional movement.
It could be that things get mixed up into the right order.
__________________
Freedom is an inside job
He says directly that he is going to take away from the rich to make equal. Dictatorial power.
What's the probabability of the armed services already having a plan in place before the electoral college meets?
Laurie